A/C not cold
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A/C not cold
Posted: June 05 2008 08:49 PM
 
Gene Riffe (aka hotrodgene) [ View ] [ genejanice@verizon.net ] [ Car Ads ] [ Blogs ]
Saint Petersburg, Florida
(727) 522-9856
 Gene Riffe
 
I have 1970 ElCamino with factory A/C tha has been changed to 134A.The air does not fill cold and will only go to about 60 deg.I have had systems over charged give problem but I vac.this one down and recharged using only 2 cans.The part that throws me is line from expansion into evap.is ice cold but come out it goes thru a large tube not sure of proper name it is not cold at all.All test have been with a large fan in front of radiator and even tried running water over condenser with no help.Also blower fan is not strong at all.All doors appear to be operating,like def.,outside and max air.I now have heater hose disconnected,still no help.
 
 
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Posted by DaveHughes  -  06/05/2008 09:40 PM
I would like to know the pressures your ac is operating at- sounds like it could be a couple different things to me- your orfice filter could be plugged or possibly your drier is full of moisture-. If you have it hooked to gauges i might be able to help more...Good luck gene you probably need air pretty bad down there about now huh?
DaveHughes [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] seaman, Ohio
 
Posted by ronhotrod  -  06/05/2008 10:17 PM
try pulling a vacuum again and charging with H12A but be careful. do not use around open flames. Dave is right about the orfice being blocked. 134A is heavier than R12 and you need to change several items to get it correctly converted.
ronhotrod [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Mount washington, Kentucky Charter Member since July 2001
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/05/2008 10:29 PM
where is orfice tube located in this system,?
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/05/2008 11:21 PM
It has all hose new but douth the orfice tube was replaced and know the orginal drier is on car.I would try the orfice filter but don't know where it is.The large tube in low side line could be the problem I was told.I don't recall the name of this but I believe it was auculator valve??????
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by Starfire  -  06/05/2008 11:51 PM
Well there you have a major problem. The dryers used in 1970 cannot be used when converting to R-134a. The PAG or POE oil required to be the carrier for the refrigerant will turn the desiccant in an old type dryer into mud and can destroy the compressor, as well as clog up orifice tubes and expansion valves. I suspect your only hope of salvaging the system will be to pull and drain all the oil from the compressor, blow out the condenser and evaporator with the proper solvent and replace the dryer with one R-134a compatible (will have a blue sticker on it). Just be sure when draining the compressor to drain into a container with markings so you can tell the exact amount of new oil to put in the compressor. Don't buy PAG oil as it is nasty and requires black rubber chemical resistant gloves to handle. POE oil will not eat your skin like PAG will.


Good Luck!
Starfire [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Weimar, Texas
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/06/2008 10:31 AM
Hey guys I apreciate all your help and you guys were right on.Ron called this AM from Hotrod Air and explained that system was not disigned to be convertered with stock drier,condenser so it seems to make me go back to R12 and flush everthing,also replace drier since my system will not flow the 134A.I really apperciate Ron taking time to call also.A big thank you to all and now on to my friends A/C repair shop.
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/09/2008 11:06 PM
Ron if still out there I have question please.You were so helpful by calling me and now I am told I also need a POA valve to complete job,what is POA aqnd its purphase.Thanks
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by Starfire  -  06/10/2008 12:09 AM
The POA valve maintains the low side at a constant 28.5 PSI.(With R12) If you need the low side constant with R-134a, I'll look pressure constant up for you for R-134a if you have decided not to stick with an R-12 system.

The original part number for your car should be AC-Delco P/N 15-5193.
Starfire [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Weimar, Texas
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/10/2008 12:09 AM
Thanks a bunch Starfire and I am going back to R12.
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by APLUS  -  06/10/2008 12:25 AM
Pilot-Operated Absolute Valve (POA). It's a suction pressure regulating valve that prevents the evaporator from going below it's setpoint to prevent evaporator freeze up. It'll keep the pressure/temperature curve around 32 degree's, just enough for max cooling without freezing up.

*I was trying to remember exactly how this valve works and before I could complete my answer "Starfire" hit it on the nose.*
APLUS [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Austin, Texas
 
Posted by jdboes  -  06/10/2008 07:49 PM
OLD AIR PRODUCTS has conversion parts, a new replacement dryer should be compatable with 134a. 2 cans of R 134a? How much is that, 24oz.? Even at 80% ( the proper charge for a 134a conversion) I don't think you've done a full charge, be sure to look up the requirement.
jdboes [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] silver spring, Maryland
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/10/2008 04:20 PM
Recieved a call today from Steve at Hotrod Air and he explained to me that my system does not have a POA valve because it has a expansion valve.Now I am a little worried about the repair shop shooting me straight.
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by Starfire  -  06/10/2008 05:48 PM
Not to worry, it's basically a nomenclature issue. Functionally an expansion valve serves the same purpose. Look under your hood and if you see something that looks like the attached photo near the passenger side firewall that should be what you need. Some GM cars of 1970 could have had either a POA or Expansion valve, leaving one to believe there may have been mid production year changes with some if not all product lines. The part in the photo is ACDELCO Part # 155774 which shows to be applicable for some El Camino's of that year.
Starfire [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Weimar, Texas
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/10/2008 08:32 PM
Jim you are no novice at this and that is clear.You guys have been a big help each time I ask.Yes your pics. is what I have,but my concern is they are telling me I also have a POA valve.I will allow them to do there thing and if charged for POA and expansion valve I have been told to ask them to show me the parts.Again thanks all.
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by Starfire  -  06/11/2008 12:00 AM
Gene - Why don't you ask them to show you where the POA valve is. If they point at the expansion valve you'll know everyone is on the same plane. That expansion valve in the photo is around $25.00. The same valve from 4 Seasons (Standard Products) is a bit less. If you feel uncomfortable with the guys you are dealing with, I'd take it to another shop with at least one old Geezer old enough to remember those types of system. But you'd better hurry, we old Geezers are hanging it up (as in retiring) in record numbers........ (grin)
Starfire [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Weimar, Texas
 
Posted by hotrodgene  -  06/13/2008 08:19 PM
The A/C is fixed after $1,362.00 and I don't fill like I have been reaped off.Parts are expensive.It is ice cold now and another thank you to all who offered there help which was right on.Thanks to Scott who call to check on everthing.
Gene Riffe [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Saint Petersburg, Florida
 
Posted by JAWS  -  06/14/2008 02:44 AM
I was gonna say, the last one I converted it held 3.75 pounds originally and a 90% charge with 134a made it ice cold.
An electrical headache can make a great car a pain [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Boise, Idaho Charter Member since August 2004
 
Posted by jimmothershead  -  06/14/2008 11:36 AM
Love my Vintage Air with Comfort Control System installed 13 years ago. 92* cruizin yesterday, SBC @ 181*, got too cold inside. Rosina insulated and sealed it in '88.

Keep kroozen, Jim
Jim [ View ] [ Email ] [ Blogs ] [ Car Ads ] Huntingtown, Maryland
 
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